You probably know Goodwill Industries International for their iconic retail stores, but what you might not know is that the organization also specializes in providing workforce development initiatives at a large scale. In this episode of All Things Work, host Tony Lee speaks with Goodwill’s president and CEO, Steve Preston, on how the organization provides comprehensive employment services that include job training, credentialing programs, direct job placement and online support to not only their 140,000 employees, but also anyone looking for a job.
You probably know Goodwill Industries International for their iconic retail stores, but what you might not know is that the organization also specializes in providing workforce development initiatives at a large scale. In this episode of All Things Work, host Tony Lee speaks with Goodwill’s president and CEO, Steve Preston, on how the organization provides comprehensive employment services that include job training, credentialing programs, direct job placement and online support to not only their 140,000 employees, but also anyone looking for a job.
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This episode of Honest HR is sponsored by PNC.
Speaker 1:
Welcome to the All Things Work podcast from the Society for Human Resource Management. I'm your host, Tony Lee, head of editorial operations here at SHRM. Thank you so much for joining us. All things work Is an audio adventure, where we talk with thought leaders and taste makers to bring you an insider's perspective on all things work. In today's episode, we're talking about workforce development. It's a big concept. And broadly it refers to the delivery of education, training and employment support services, that assist people of all backgrounds. But two groups who can especially benefit from workforce development efforts, are individuals with criminal histories and those with disabilities because services and training can help them overcome the social stigma and demonstrate to employers that they're ready and able to work.
One organization that specializes in workforce development is Goodwill Industries International. It's really interesting that we have Steve Preston joining us today. Steve is Goodwill's president and CEO, and he's going to share a lot of great info about Goodwill's mission and purpose. But Steve has a very impressive background prior to joining Goodwill in 2019, he was the secretary of the Department of Housing and Urban Development. Before that, he was administrator of the Small Business Administration. Steve's held numerous senior leadership positions during his career in both the private and the public sector. And frankly, it's just a real pleasure to welcome you, Steve. Thanks for coming to All Things Work.
Speaker 2:
Great. Thank you very much for having me. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, no, thank you. So I think when most people think of Goodwill, the first thing they think of are the retail outlets, all the stores around the country where they can go in and get clothing and other essentials. And I think most people realize that those stores employ folks that Goodwill targets in their workforce development and initiatives. And I know that Goodwill uses the revenue from those sales to create job and training opportunities for people to help them reach self-sufficiency and their full potential through the power of work. Can you explain the effort, how Goodwill works and how it's helping those employees?
Speaker 2:
Yeah. Well thank you for asking. And I think as you noted, most people do know us for our stores because they see them everywhere, but they don't really know the purpose for those stores. So we do it a number of ways. First of all, the stores do provide direct employment opportunities. We employ about 140,000 people across the country. Many of those people come to us with any number of life challenges. And so we are a very important step forward in providing them opportunity. So they get employment with us, hopefully they'll advance in the stores into higher positions and they can even get training for other roles. However, the funding that comes out of those stores also supports 650 workforce development centers. So those are separate centers apart from the stores. And in those centers, we provide training and development services. We may provide credentialing programs and we also provide direct job placement services.
So those are dedicated centers where people who are not employed by us can come for support. And then the third place, which is really important to remember is we provide support to millions of people online. And in fact, if you go into goodwill.org right now, you can find job opportunities through a direct link we have with the deed.com. You can actually take online courses. And so we really have a comprehensive approach through the stores, through our workforce development centers and through online support, to help people find that opportunity that they're looking for and make sure that they're prepared for it.
Speaker 1:
That's fantastic. What a great effort. Are there certain segments of the workforce that you specifically target?
Speaker 2:
Well, we provide support to anyone who comes to us. Now many times there are specific programs because of unique needs that people have. So you opened up by discussing people coming out of incarceration. And we have a number of very successful, dedicated programs for people who are coming out of incarceration. We have specific dedicated programs for people with disabilities and for older workers. And in some cases, people like veterans who are going through transitions or people who have been displaced. So sometimes we're called upon to structure a uniquely focused program, based on the needs of those individuals. But it's much more common for people to come to us more broadly to seek support. And in doing that, we give them help with workforce readiness skills. We provide extensive digital skills training. In many cases, we partner with community colleges for credentials or other types of support. So sometimes it's, we do have directed programs for particular people groups, but our approach generally is to support people more broadly with the skills and supports they need to be competitive for jobs in their local markets.
Speaker 1:
Yeah. What a great effort. So I don't know if you're familiar, a couple of years ago, SHRM launched something called Together Forward @Work, which is a program specifically targeted to helping those with criminal histories find employment. And we've done a lot to try and match up employers there. So I guess my question to you is let's look at the flip side, you're helping job seekers. What can companies do, who want to work with Goodwill to connect with job candidates who are part of the untapped talent potential?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, so that's an easy answer they can call us. If you're a local employer, you can actually reach out to your local Goodwill. If you're a national employer with many locations that you're looking to find candidates for, you can work with us nationally. And it's very important to do that because by having that direct employer relationship, we can begin to develop an understanding of the profile of the candidate that the employer's looking for and then ensure that the people who come to us looking for skills or other kinds of support can prepare themselves for those roles. So we do have hiring relationships with some of the largest employers in the country, and we have hiring relationships with very small businesses. It really goes across the board.
We work very hard to ensure that when people come to us for support, we help them understand the opportunities available to them locally because ultimately all jobs are local. And most people who are looking for that support are looking to remain local. So they need the skills to compete for those specific opportunities. And then we work with them to get those skills and any other forms of support that they may need along that journey. And then we work with them to actually prepare for the interview process and prepare for the workplace. So our support is pretty comprehensive and it's best when we're doing it in conjunction with local employers.
Speaker 1:
Yeah. That's terrific. So a lot of our listeners, they live for case studies. Tell me exactly how it works. So can you share an example of a company that worked with Goodwill to find reskilled employees that were ready to launch say a digital career or turnover over a new leaf?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, so we do it in a number of ways. So we are, for example right now, and I'll touch on digital more specifically. But broadly we're working with a couple of healthcare providers right now to deliver very specific healthcare content or healthcare training to people, so that they can compete for specific job openings. Some of those might be a pharmacy assistant or somebody who is working on the nursing staff. We work with local manufacturers who have specific skill needs and sometimes we'll provide those skills directly or we'll partner with specific community colleges. And we work with any number of other employers who are looking for specific credentials, whether it be in the hospitality industry or some other area. So we're very good at connecting the dots on the ground when somebody comes to us and says, we need these skills, can you work with us to get those delivered?
And we are beginning to do that nationally as well. On the digital side, that's especially important because digital skills have become the gateway for people to move beyond lower skilled service roles, into higher skilled opportunities. And even those basic skills are required for people to go into any kind of a job where you need to use technology. And sometimes people can't even qualify to be trained in a new job if they don't have the basic technical skills to get online and learn. Right? So over the past three years, we've had a great collaboration with Google to expand our ability to train people on digital skills, everywhere from introductory skills, all the way up to programming and cybersecurity and those types of things. And we have provided that support to over a million people through those programs. And we're seeing that the people who acquire those digital skills are consistently showing better advancement in higher wages once they're through the program. So that is the door opener and the access point for people looking to move forward into higher paying, higher skilled roles.
Speaker 1:
Wow, fantastic effort and what scale. It's heartening that you mentioned that small businesses are working with Goodwill just as well. So if I'm an HR manager at a company with a couple hundred employees, and I want to work with my local Goodwill to identify candidates, do I just call somebody up? Do I go on your website? What would you recommend there?
Speaker 2:
I would recommend that if you're a small business and you want to begin hiring locally, you pick up the phone and call the local Goodwill and have a conversation to understand the programs that we have in place and the people we work with and how to connect those dots. And those are great calls for us to get, because ultimately we are looking to place people in good opportunities and make sure that they're prepared to be successful in them. And so if we have that relationship, we can understand from the company what you're looking for, what defines success and make sure that the people we connect you with will succeed in those roles.
Speaker 1:
Great. So let's, let's go back into ancient history like a year ago before the pandemic. And we spent a lot of time on this podcast and elsewhere on shrm.org, talking about the incredible talent shortages that companies just couldn't find the employees that they sought. And part of that encouraged companies to start hiring untapped talent like they never had before. Three and four years ago, it was rare to hear an HR department or recruiter, talk about hiring people with physical or mental disabilities or with criminal histories or people who didn't even have high school degrees. Now the economy has obviously changed through the pandemic. Do you think that hiring was a short term reaction to the tight job market then? Or do you think there really has been a true change in how companies are looking at people that they may not have looked at before to employ?
Speaker 2:
Yeah. Well, the short answer is we don't know, but we are very, very hopeful. We are very hopeful that the pre pandemic experience opened the minds of employers into who their next grade hire could be, and that it has begun to alter the screening and evaluation process for new candidates. And that is a really big deal. And it's frequently an issue of equity. Because often when an employer puts out a job description, it puts out requirements for that job. The bar is structured in such a way that it screens out many people who are actually qualified for the job, based on the experiences that they have or based on the skills they've acquired. And I think probably the simple example is, you need a bachelor's degree to compete for this role. And very frequently, you really don't need that. Now I was very encouraged in December when the business round table announced a multi-year effort to reform companies hiring and talent management practices to emphasize the value of stills rather than just degrees and this was a very specific focused effort to improve equity, diversity in workplace culture.
And the focus is not only on the recruitment process, but also on the advancement process. And as you know the work for The Business Round Table comprises the largest companies in the country. I think they had already 80 or more companies that signed on to this effort and taking on this issue of relevant skills is really critical to be able to open up the aperture as people look at a broader candidate pool. So we need to see that fundamental shift in how people screen and evaluate candidates. We need to focus specifically on skills that are relevant to the job. And we need to understand whether those skills can come through prior work experience or through specific training. Because once again, historically many people disproportionately people of color have been screened out unnecessarily, and that's a very important way for us to advance the conversation around really what does constitute a qualified employee and what is going to ensure that they're successful.
Speaker 1:
Yeah. And you hit on a great point there because we often hear from employers who say, yes, we're making an effort to hire from this untapped talent pool and that's the end of the conversation. But there are opportunities to advance those employees as well, that a lot of companies aren't looking at. And research has shown that a lot of folks from the untapped talent pools tend to be more loyal employees than others, more open and willing to be trained and upskilled. Are you finding that to be the case as well?
Speaker 2:
It's interesting that you mentioned that, I recently did a panel with someone from Dave's Killer Bread company and they employ a significant percentage of their team from people who've come out of incarceration. And as they've studied this issue within their own employee base, they have found a very strong retention, loyalty and quality among people who've come out of incarceration. And in many cases we do see deeper loyalty and deeper commitment because people are so thankful to have that opportunity. And these are people specifically, who've not had opportunity in life. Who after incarceration are frequently excluded from opportunity either from over regulations or standards or just by people's unwillingness to give them a chance.
And so I think it's an important thing to really seize upon when we think about what kind of labor force do we want? What kind of culture do we want? What kind of statement do we want to make with whom we hire and who is going to provide us with the right kind of workforce to advance that culture and that ethos? But there are many people out there who would say that you might find greater loyalty, greater support, and in many cases better work from people that you might not have hired previously.
Speaker 1:
Yeah. No, it's so true. Thank you for saying that. So I'm going to pivot a little bit, I have to ask you served as HUD secretary, you served as administrator of the US Small Business Administration. So we now have a new administration with, with president Biden. What initiatives do you expect to see in the next four years or so that'll be aimed at enhancing the workplace for untapped talent?
Speaker 2:
Well, the new president has already begun to discuss some of his intentions and those intentions do focus on a number of job programs. He's focused on state and local workforce training programs and Goodwill provides training across the country through many of these programs. So we're looking forward to participating in those and ensuring that we work very closely with state and local authorities to advance those programs. More specifically, the president has talked about increasing the number of apprenticeship programs, supporting community colleges, which as I mentioned earlier, provide a very important component in helping people get credentials and other relevant local skills. And we partner with over 140 community colleges across the country. He specifically highlighted second chance individuals, which we've been talking about and Goodwill participates in many of those programs. In fact, we just have remarkably low recidivism rates among the individuals that come through our programs. And also people with disabilities.
So not only broad workforce development programs, but also very specifically focused on apprenticeships and community college and people groups, including second chance individuals and people with disabilities. So we are very excited to see what that looks like. One of the great things about our network is that we stand ready to advance all of those programs, because those are all of things that we do already. So as the government seeks to partner more with people on the ground, we look forward to being one of those partners.
Speaker 1:
That's great. Well, very hopeful. Well, we're almost out of time, Steve but I wanted to ask you one other question. The pandemic has such a negative impact on everyone, but have you seen any silver linings at Goodwill that's emerged over the last year?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, so I think there are always silver linings, even though this has been terribly difficult and the pandemic has disproportionately hit people, people from lower income groups, people of color, people with lower education levels. So we've very much focused on supporting people who have that need but at the same time, we do see good things that have emerged. We see innovation in reaching people who need us. Virtual support has been expanded dramatically because people have had to do it. So we do online training, online coaching, online classes that we haven't done historically to the same degree. That virtual support can open up access to those very people I mentioned, who may not otherwise have access to it. Now we do have the challenge that there continues to be a digital divide in the country. So many people don't have access to online unfortunately but those who do may find it actually easier to get services than they have historically and so our reach expands.
I think, as a country, it's given us greater visibility into the gap that you mentioned earlier, you mentioned the pre pandemic gap. And at that point we had 7 million unfilled jobs and many more people who are either unemployed or underemployed and employers saying, we just can't fill those jobs. Now we've got much more visibility into what that looks like because we're constantly hearing reports, we're constantly seeing those statistics that articulate that difference. And we're getting as a result, deeper visibility into the inequities that we face in our country and how workforce development and thinking differently about how we hire can begin to address at least some of those inequities. So it's expanded our reach. It's given access to more people, even though that's not perfect. And it's given us greater visibility into the problems that need to be addressed in ways that I think touch people every day in relevant ways that help them get better jobs, better futures in a more hopeful path forward.
Speaker 1:
I'm so thrilled to hear an optimistic outlook. That's wonderful as we all grapple with ending the pandemic. Well, unfortunately we have run out of time. This has been great. I really appreciate it. This has been Steve Preston. Thank you so much for joining me to talk about Goodwill's workforce development initiatives. Before we get out of here, I just want to encourage everyone to subscribe to this podcast on apple podcasts and Spotify, Stitcher, Google Play, wherever you listen to podcasts. And while you're at it, be sure to give us a five star rating and leave a review. And also be sure to check out SHRM on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn, and you can find all of our episodes and other podcasts from SHRM on our website at shrm.org/podcast. Thanks for listening. And we'll catch you next time on All Things Work.